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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 1:19 pm 
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Beast, on the topic of Gaea vs Crusher: I think it's a question of card choices. Fe. I like my Ignitions and Crusher is a great target, strong and hexproof, Gaea can't be a target so it would leave me with a dead card in hand.

If you face alot of chumps/tokens Gaea's is also a worse choice unless you manage to sweep the board before casting Gaea and take advantage of the haste.

Gaea is better vs counter decks, but there are not that many around. I would also pick Gaea in a control deck as a finisher when I'm sure I can keep the opponent's board clear.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 1:20 pm 
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As you said.. it's a question of card choices. Rolling Thunder/Radiant Flames knocks the chumps out of Gaea's way.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 22, 2015 1:51 pm 
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I'm glad we agree ;-)


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 17, 2016 2:28 pm 
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Hakeem928 wrote:
Allies as a tribe suck, you need a critical density of them so that means you have to make a lot of subpar choices and leave out lots of objectively better cards. When your opponent doesn't interact, you smash them and when they do you get smashed. I deleted mine.

Some Allies are good enough on their own just for the one-time EtB and Firemantle Mage is definitely one of those. If I were inclined to play red creature-based aggro, I think he'd be automatic.


Hello everybody,
It makes a lot of times since I read your post and with all the respect I have for you,Hakeem, I have to disagree (and agree with you which is paradoxal) when you say "Allies as a tribe suck"
It's true that you need a critical density of allies if you want them to be effective, so I tried to do a deck who can provide me a lot of allies.
Picking cards and launching allies is the core of this deck
I don't care if one of them die, they're just cannon meat who can give me more cards thanks to Evolutionary Leap and it works pretty well with Flameshadow Conjuring as you all know.

So this is the deck :

2 x Kor Bladewhirl +1 ally, can be easily removed but sometimes first strike is good
2 x Evolutionary Leap no comment, a must have in a green deck
2 x Reprisal keep it for the flying ones, we are poor against them :ahem:
2 x Ondu Rising always good to stay alive :)
2 x Lantern Scout always good to stay alive
3 x Firemantle Mage +1 ally, menace
1 x Nissa, Vastwood Seer +1 ally, no comment
2 x Tajuru Stalwart +1 ally, not the better one
3 x Iroas's Champion a good lure always targeted (people don't like double strike )
2 x Veteran Warleader +1 ally, no comment
2 x Elemental Bond As I said I need Allies to launch
2 x Chasm Guide +1 ally, haste
3 x Ondu Champion +1 ally, trample
2 x Munda, Ambush Leader to use with caution (I only play him after putting Evolutionary Leap or Flameshadow Conjuring,Elemental Bond )
2 x Flameshadow Conjuring I love this card
1 x Gideon, Ally of Zendikar +1 ally, no comment
2 x Angel of Renewal +1 ally, always good to stay alive
1 x Woodland Bellower can bring an ally easily

Lands
4 x Plains
5 x Mountain
7 x Forest
2 x Rootbound Crag
2 x Clifftop Retreat
2 x Sunpetal Grove
1 x Rogue's Passage
1 x Gruul Guildgate
1 x Evolving Wilds

I know there are lots of creatures who can be stronger than these ones but i just wanted to do it with allies (and this is why Iroas's Champion normally doesn't have his place here)
I question myself on the utility of 2 x Elemental Bond with my lots of 2/2 allies, but I need to get cards to launch a lots of allies (and Gideon, Ally of Zendikar can make this combo easier with the +1/+1 boost).
Kor Bladewhirl, Woodland Bellower, Evolving Wilds and Iroas's Champion can be easily changed in this deck
Hero of Goma Fada is a good card, but it rarely makes more than 1 round (always destroyed or exiled) however I'll probably add it in my next games
Retreat to Emeria is a good one too but it doesn''t work well with Flameshadow Conjuring. It still is a good card for an allies deck
I had to test it with Might of the Masses, Infuse with the Elements or Sigil of Valor, I still don't know which one to choose
I'm actually poor against flying, any advices? Suppression Bonds maybe ?
This deck is still in construction, and I really need advices to make it better.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 17, 2016 3:21 pm 
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I really don't think the Evoleap/Flameshadow Conjuring machine works well with Naya Allies. Your deck does not run any Rally trigger that benefits from having two allies enter the battlefield, the second ally is not going to have a big impact on turn 5 (which is the earliest you can have Flameshadow Conjuring do work) or later; Evoleap always sacs a real creature (except Gideon/Conjuring tokens), and it does not get huge payoffs.

I believe that if you are not running the lifegain-themed allies (Kalastria Healer, Serene Steward, Bloodbond Vampire), you want to be a more aggressive deck since you don't have the stayingpower to last in a long game (you are very weak to sweepers and you don't have great answers to opposing big bombs, especially if you can't cast Reprisal to get rid of them (e.g. Plated Crusher, Gaea's Revenge, Ulamog)).

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 18, 2016 1:39 pm 
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Modulo wrote:
I really don't think the Evoleap/Flameshadow Conjuring machine works well with Naya Allies. Your deck does not run any Rally trigger that benefits from having two allies enter the battlefield, the second ally is not going to have a big impact on turn 5 (which is the earliest you can have Flameshadow Conjuring do work) or later; Evoleap always sacs a real creature (except Gideon/Conjuring tokens), and it does not get huge payoffs.

I believe that if you are not running the lifegain-themed allies (Kalastria Healer, Serene Steward, Bloodbond Vampire), you want to be a more aggressive deck since you don't have the stayingpower to last in a long game (you are very weak to sweepers and you don't have great answers to opposing big bombs, especially if you can't cast Reprisal to get rid of them (e.g. Plated Crusher, Gaea's Revenge, Ulamog)).


Thank you Modulo, I agree with you for the impact of the second ally and the fact that's it only on T5, but (there's always a but :) )Evolutionary Leap works with the token created by Flameshadow Conjuring (well, it works on my iphone), I just let the token created attack and kill it before the end of the turn.
Maybe I was not clear in my explanations, but the deck is not based on Flameshadow Conjuring, it's just a good combo with Evolutionary Leap (well IMO but your comment cooled me a little :) )
I agree too that this doesn't have a big impact on the game, but it keeps under pressure the opponent. As I said before, the core of this deck is not to finish the opponent with a big one but with little ones that you launch as often as possible.
I've changed some card as you can see, and finally opted for Aligned Hedron Network instead of Suppression Bonds but it's too early to say if it works better
Deck updated :
2 x Might of the Masses
2 x Kor Bladewhirl
2 x Evolutionary Leap
2 x Reprisal
2 x Lantern Scout
3 x Firemantle Mage
1 x Nissa, Vastwood Seer
2 x Tajuru Stalwart
2 x Veteran Warleader
2 x Elemental Bond
2 x Chasm Guide
3 x Ondu Champion
2 x Munda, Ambush Leader
2 x Suppression Bonds
2 x Flameshadow Conjuring
1 x Gideon, Ally of Zendikar
2 x Hero of Goma Fada
2 x Angel of Renewal


Lands
6 x Plains
5 x Mountain
5 x Forest
2 x Rootbound Crag
2 x Clifftop Retreat
1 x Gruul Guildgate
1 x Evolving Wilds
1 x Selesnya Guildgate


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 19, 2016 10:58 am 
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I'm just postulating here, but do you think that Wizards will decline to give us both pieces of the Eldrazi Displacer Infinite combo?
And if they don't and we get both pieces, do you think Valor in Akros will finally have it's time to shine?

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 19, 2016 11:14 am 
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What's the other piece of the infinite combo? I do love me some cloudshifting!

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 19, 2016 12:26 pm 
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What's the other piece of the infinite combo? I do love me some cloudshifting!


Something that poops a bunch of scions IIRC.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 19, 2016 10:41 pm 
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A wild reddit post appeared!
The combo has great synergy in both naya and abzan (abzan can literally draw your entire deck with either an enchantment from origins or a 4/3 flying rare from BFZ).

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 21, 2016 6:55 am 
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chile125 wrote:
I'm just postulating here, but do you think that Wizards will decline to give us both pieces of the Eldrazi Displacer Infinite combo?
And if they don't and we get both pieces, do you think Valor in Akros will finally have it's time to shine?


I don't know for the "infinite combo", but for me, Valor in Akros is (unfortunatly) too slow for the deck I posted.
It's a good card who can pump up the creatures, but I don't need it. I need to launch a lot of creatures but not specifically strong ones
Unless after T5-6 where I can put 2 or 3 allies on the same round, I don't think Valor in Akros is the best suited for this deck.
IMO, it should be used with an Eldrazi or meca deck (or elves but I hate to play with them) or with cards with flash like Thunderclap Wyvern or Bounding Krasisfor an surprise effect in defense (which is always fun :))


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 21, 2016 7:04 am 
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It would only be an infinite combo if a create gave 3 scion tokens when entering the battlefield so you could just use the new tokens to pay the shift cost and then if you had Valor in Akros in play you would get infinite triggers but I don't think there are any that give 3 except the processor one but that wouldn't be infinite. Still shifting the green one that spawns 2 tokens would be pretty effective.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 21, 2016 1:06 pm 
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The Naya Ramp decklist that should've been...(UPDATED on the 22nd of Jan)

Fast mana...
4 x Natural Connection
4 x Mwonvuli Acid-Moss
2 x Nissa's Renewal
2 x Animist's Awakening

Draw & Tutoring & Utility...
4 x Elvish Visionary
2 x Evolutionary Leap
1 x Felidar Cub
1 x Nissa, Vastwood Seer
3 x Retreat to Emeria
1 x Gideon, Ally of Zendikar

Board stabilizers...
2 x Radiant Flames
2 x Planar Outburst
1 x Rolling Thunder
1 x Angelic Edict

End game and combo pieces...
1 x Greenwarden of Murasa
2 x Emeria Shepherd

The Lands...
2 x Cinder Glade
2 x Canopy Vista
4 x Evolving Wilds
3 x Foundry of the Consuls
1 x Mortuary Mire
7 x Forest
5 x Plains
3 x Mountain

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Last edited by InFaMoUsGeMiNi on Fri Jan 22, 2016 2:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 22, 2016 9:53 am 
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It would only be an infinite combo if a create gave 3 scion tokens when entering the battlefield so you could just use the new tokens to pay the shift cost and then if you had Valor in Akros in play you would get infinite triggers but I don't think there are any that give 3 except the processor one but that wouldn't be infinite. Still shifting the green one that spawns 2 tokens would be pretty effective.

lol, wut? I even posted a link...
chile125 wrote:
A wild reddit post appeared!
The combo has great synergy in both naya and abzan (abzan can literally draw your entire deck with either an enchantment from origins or a 4/3 flying rare from BFZ).

There IS a new eldrazi that gives exactly 3 tokens and I was asking if you guys thought that Wizards would give us both the Brood and the Displacer since together they can make a single creature, with either flying or unblockable to hit for infinite damage if you have Valor.

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 22, 2016 2:33 pm 
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 22, 2016 2:46 pm 
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idk why you keep talking about this we don't have brood monitor in our pool, the only card that produces 3 scions when it comes in is blight herder and sorry but that's not a combo that'll last for very long


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 23, 2016 12:14 am 
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idk why you keep talking about this we don't have brood monitor in our pool, the only card that produces 3 scions when it comes in is blight herder and sorry but that's not a combo that'll last for very long

We don't have Displacer, yet, either...

The initial post was asking the question of, "Will Wizards give us both pieces at all, considering that we would have our first infinite loop in a game that is not intended to rotate, unlike previous DotP releases?" and "If they do give us both cards, will Valor in Akros finally see some use?"
It's a hypothetical; I'm sorry if I failed to make that obvious from the getgo.

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 23, 2016 12:22 am 
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chile125 wrote:
idk why you keep talking about this we don't have brood monitor in our pool, the only card that produces 3 scions when it comes in is blight herder and sorry but that's not a combo that'll last for very long

We don't have Displacer, yet, either.


The difference is that brood monitor is a BFZ card, not an OGW card.


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PostPosted: Sat Jan 23, 2016 12:54 am 
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Displacer would open up a ton of builds.. I hope we get it, but we probably won't.

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PostPosted: Sat Jan 23, 2016 1:16 am 
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More importantly when are they gonna give us a time warp effect that sticks around for the Displacer + possessed skaab shenanigans


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