It is currently Thu Feb 22, 2018 1:37 pm

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 15 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 10:55 pm 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Jun 28, 2017
Posts: 146
Mission Statement

So the first thing you may notice about me is that dragons are awesome. Okay, so that's not really "about me". It's just objective fact, and the sooner everyone realises and accepts this simple truth the better off we'll all be. So when Dragons of Tarkir was first announced, I was really looking forward to it. Finally, after Scourge failed to deliver on its promise of "the definitive Dragon set", we were getting another shot at it!

...what a let down that turned out to be.

Dragons of Tarkir was, I felt, a huge disappointment. It felt less like "DRAGONS of Tarkir" and more like "Khans of Tarkir 2.0: Now They're Big And Scaly". It focused too much on being the third Tarkir set and not enough on being the definitive Dragon set. Fine for those people who wanted that sort of thing, I suppose, but for a guy who hated Khans of Tarkir, had no real interest in "the third Tarkir set", and just wanted an awesome fun Dragon-y time, I was disappointed.

Thus I decided to get off my hoard of gold, stretch my wings, and put together "the Dragon set" myself.

The purpose of this set wasn't just to show off some Dragons (although that is one thing I wanted to do as well). It was to evoke the feeling of being a Dragon. The mechanics, the themes, the flavour - everything was chosen with the express purpose of making you, the player, feel like a Dragon. Spells with names like Rending Claws, Intimidating Roar, and Feast on the Weak to represent your array of natural weaponry. A cycle of spells representing your given breath weapon. The hoard mechanic lets you amass a pile of Treasure, while the land subtype Lair makes its first appearance since Planeshift, and is much expanded upon to let you establish your own domain. And of course, what good is being a Dragon if you don't get to chow down on some overzealous Knights?
******Full Spoiler******

White


Blue


Black


Red


Green


Multicolour


Artifacts


Lands


Token images


Last edited by Arix on Tue Nov 21, 2017 6:51 am, edited 19 times in total.

Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: [DRD] Dragon's Dawn
PostPosted: Thu Jun 29, 2017 10:21 pm 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Sep 16, 2015
Posts: 1184
:u: seems undefined here, and I would like to see what could come out of it. Probably a group of creatures that are immune to dragons because they're underwater? Cephalids perhaps? Kraken?

In fact, that might be another reason for me to go to the set. Seeing a mono-:u: antagonist that doesn't try to be the good guy, but have the bad traits be uniquely :u: for uniquely :u: reasons would be nice.

I can generally guess that :b::r: are "pure" dragons, :r::g: are the young dragons and wild humans, :g::w: are knights. But dragons are :r:, so :b: needs something to supplement it and :u: needs a lot of stuff to supplement it.

Are you thinking of bringing Sarkhan Vol into the mix? Or Tezzeret? Or are you going to go a different route, like with the Cephalids and Kraken, or Drakes?

EDIT: gold tokens. I don't think they belong in :u:, unless attached to a large beatstick (unlikely) or Prowess creatures which the blue player expects to earn something out of. Needless to say, the Cephalid argument strengthens a bit.


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: [DRD] Dragon's Dawn
PostPosted: Thu Jun 29, 2017 10:41 pm 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Jun 28, 2017
Posts: 146
:u: seems undefined here, and I would like to see what could come out of it. Probably a group of creatures that are immune to dragons because they're underwater? Cephalids perhaps? Kraken?
I'm not too big on either of those ideas - the point is that dragons rule the world now and there is no escape, having a faction of creatures that are just like "lol whatevs" kind of messes with that. But you are right in that blue doesn't have a lot of definition right now. That's something I'll need to work on. Currently blue is mostly home to ex-inhabitants of the castle, perhaps that theme could be strengthened a little? Maybe some people who have banded together to try and better their conditions in a dragon-filled world?

Quote:
In fact, that might be another reason for me to go to the set. Seeing a mono-:u: antagonist that doesn't try to be the good guy, but have the bad traits be uniquely :u: for uniquely :u: reasons would be nice.
Although not monoblue, I do have an idea for a character that could fit this definition. He's black at the moment, but I could see a way he could shift into blue/black. He's a necromancer who teams up with Udiil, resurrecting dead dragons while Udiil directs the living ones.

Quote:
I can generally guess that :b::r: are "pure" dragons, :r::g: are the young dragons and wild humans, :g::w: are knights. But dragons are :r:, so :b: needs something to supplement it and :u: needs a lot of stuff to supplement it.
Dragons show up in every colour, though they're lightest in green, being flying creatures. Black is also home to the less savoury residents of the castle - the vermin and undead monsters that inhabited the dungeon (there's a few hints sprinkled around that the great castle was not as utopian as it seemed).

Quote:
Are you thinking of bringing Sarkhan Vol into the mix? Or Tezzeret? Or are you going to go a different route, like with the Cephalids and Kraken, or Drakes?
I'm not a fan of using established canon characters in my fan works. I'd rather tell my own story than a spinoff. And drakes seem a bit too close to dragons - like, if the point is to show a world consumed by dragons, why feature an inferior scaly flying creature?

Quote:
EDIT: gold tokens. I don't think they belong in :u:, unless attached to a large beatstick (unlikely) or Prowess creatures which the blue player expects to earn something out of. Needless to say, the Cephalid argument strengthens a bit.
It plays into blue's affinity for artifacts. There are several cards which give your Treasures different abilities, and which like having Treasures around.


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: [DRD] Dragon's Dawn
PostPosted: Thu Jun 29, 2017 11:42 pm 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Sep 16, 2015
Posts: 1184
There was a time when :u: had turn 2 mana production. Mind Stone was very strong in control decks, even if it's just you drawing a card.


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: [DRD] Dragon's Dawn
PostPosted: Fri Jun 30, 2017 6:26 am 
Offline
Member

Joined: Oct 01, 2014
Posts: 132
Identity: Able of Reproduce
Preferred Pronoun Set: Call me whatever; I find it enlightening
Claim Territory doesn't really look like something that would be printed at common. Frenzied Tilling got moved up to uncommon in its most recent printing, and the multicolored part doesn't matter since that was in a gold set.

Blue could have more trickster style dragons with a focus on using ice or mist. There could be some Dragon transformation stuff with Wings of Velis Vel type effects as well.


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: [DRD] Dragon's Dawn
PostPosted: Fri Jun 30, 2017 6:40 am 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Jun 28, 2017
Posts: 146
preadatordetecor wrote:
There was a time when :u: had turn 2 mana production. Mind Stone was very strong in control decks, even if it's just you drawing a card.
Indeed there was. That won't be happening here, though. Hoard is admittedly hard to develop for, but comparable to Eldrazi Spawn/Scions. You won't be ramping out of control on turn 2.

Claim Territory doesn't really look like something that would be printed at common. Frenzied Tilling got moved up to uncommon in its most recent printing, and the multicolored part doesn't matter since that was in a gold set.
Hm, that is a fair point. I'm not sure if it's unreasonable for it to be at common. Power level is nothing major - there is a big different between five and six mana when it comes to both mana ramp and denial - and it's not overly complex. This will require further testing.

Quote:
Blue could have more trickster style dragons with a focus on using ice or mist. There could be some Dragon transformation stuff with Wings of Velis Vel type effects as well.
All these things will be included. Frost dragons were a shoe-in from the beginning, as frost breath is arguably the next most common dragon breath weapon after fire. As for transformation:
Image
Illusion of Glory
Instant (R)
Exile target creature. Its controller creates a 4/4 red Dragon creature token with flying. When that token leaves the battlefield, return the exiled card to the battlefield under its owner's control.
: Return ~from your graveyard to your hand.


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: [DRD] Dragon's Dawn
PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2017 8:31 am 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Jun 28, 2017
Posts: 146
UPDATE: The first pass of the white commons has been posted. It's just a first pass, so comments and suggestions are welcome.


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: [DRD] Dragon's Dawn
PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2017 11:12 am 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Sep 16, 2015
Posts: 1184
These cards are... lovely. I really like cards such as Heroic Sacrifice, being a Bone Splinters instant spell that is a little bit more restricted.

Although I do have to say some of them I don't really like.

Support of the Masses is very strong. I would run that over Crusader of Odric any day of the week.
Trained Griffin is very easy to get up and running.

Griffineer Trainee is way too strong. Welkin Tern with no drawbacks and upside? Why would you not run it? Please nerf it.

I kind of want Ancient Griffineer to be :u:. I'm quite fairly tired of seeing a bunch of :w: cards referencing equipment when they already have a very, very strong suite of aggressive strategies. It would be cool for :w::u: or mono-:u: equipment decks to be a thing.


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: [DRD] Dragon's Dawn
PostPosted: Wed Jul 05, 2017 8:50 pm 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Jun 28, 2017
Posts: 146
These cards are... lovely. I really like cards such as Heroic Sacrifice, being a Bone Splinters instant spell that is a little bit more restricted.
Thanks! Heroic Sacrifice is one of my favourites from a flavour perspective, which is kind of important for a top-down set.

Quote:
Support of the Masses is very strong. I would run that over Crusader of Odric any day of the week.
Really, as an Aura though? Auras are famously weak, and this one doesn't actually do anything on its own. I thought it was one of the weakest cards in the lot.

Quote:
Trained Griffin is very easy to get up and running.
Too easy? Entirely possible. I think this one would require testing to find out just how easy it is to turn on.

Quote:
Griffineer Trainee is way too strong. Welkin Tern with no drawbacks and upside? Why would you not run it? Please nerf it.
In all fairness, white gets Welkin Tern without drawback at common (see also, Stormfront Pegasus). Although giving it another look, it hasn't actually yet received a version with an upside - only at rare, in Selfless Spirit. It was originally a 1/3, but I changed it to give white another aggressive 2-drop alongside Frontline Spearmaster, as the other two drops (Merestan Retainers and Merestan Skirmisher) tend towards a more defensive style. Perhaps some numbers could be shuffled around.

Quote:
I kind of want Ancient Griffineer to be :u:. I'm quite fairly tired of seeing a bunch of :w: cards referencing equipment when they already have a very, very strong suite of aggressive strategies. It would be cool for :w::u: or mono-:u: equipment decks to be a thing.
This has to do with the limited archetypes. /'s archetype is fliers, while / is Equipment, and Ancient Griffineer is intended both as a common reward for the Equipment deck and a way to potentially bridge the two themes. I do like the idea of a Equipment deck though, perhaps I'll keep it in mind for another set?


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: [DRD] Dragon's Dawn
PostPosted: Thu Jul 06, 2017 11:24 pm 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Jun 28, 2017
Posts: 146
UPDATE: First pass of the blue commons is up. Again, all input is welcome.

Griffineer Trainee has lost reinforce, becoming a functional reprint of Stormfront Pegasus. This also has the effect of making it a little harder to turn on Trained Griffin, but I'm going to wait until I get to the testing phase before deciding if the Griffin needs further nerfing.


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: [DRD] Dragon's Dawn
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 12:18 pm 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Sep 16, 2015
Posts: 1184
Dedicated Trainee - Sweet. I would love a :u: Soldier tribal deck some time. The problem is the flavor text, and the name. It sounds like a :w: card.

Engulf - Did you plan on making this card have Hoard? Because it's not very good. I'd rather run Cancel and that card was pretty bad.

Gold Guardian - I don't think I would play this. It's cute though.

Haughty Thief - Seems :b:. Died to greedy behavior, which :u: is unlikely to do.

Illishar's Chosen - it would be sweet if it was a Bird Soldier. Otherwise, solid card.

Illusory Dragon - It's okay I guess. It would be sweet if this creature had another ability, like Prowess (where the player's magic getting stronger makes the illusion stronger as well). Other than that, I don't really think the card would see play because it costs so much. I'm not that well versed in Commander though.

Intimidating Roar - Flavor is new. Nonetheless, it's a :u: removal spell, that is very, very close to killing things. But :u: got this before.

Raid the Hoard - I really hope that there's a Goblin Electromancer around here because a lot of these instants and sorceries are very, very expensive.


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: [DRD] Dragon's Dawn
PostPosted: Sun Jul 09, 2017 4:12 pm 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Sep 16, 2015
Posts: 1184
Arix, have you heard about the legend of the dragon's gate? It should be familiar because of Magikarp.


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: [DRD] Dragon's Dawn
PostPosted: Sun Jul 09, 2017 7:55 pm 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Jun 28, 2017
Posts: 146
Dedicated Trainee - Sweet. I would love a :u: Soldier tribal deck some time. The problem is the flavor text, and the name. It sounds like a :w: card.

Haughty Thief - Seems :b:. Died to greedy behavior, which :u: is unlikely to do.
I'm going to tell you a secret - I'm not good at flavour text. That said, it's not like blue is unfamiliar with haughtiness and hubris. Just look at all the counterspells with "I'm better than you" flavour text. It's just that this time it ended badly for them.

Quote:
Engulf - Did you plan on making this card have Hoard? Because it's not very good. I'd rather run Cancel and that card was pretty bad.
No. In fact, Beneath Notice used to have hoard instead of a cantrip, but I felt blue had enough hoard at common already. That said, Engulf originally cost , but that seemed too strong at common.

Quote:
Illishar's Chosen - it would be sweet if it was a Bird Soldier. Otherwise, solid card.
Honestly, I just have a personal preference for the Warrior type over Soldier. I find it more evocative and just...well, just a cooler word. And from a flavour perspective, it makes more sense for this guy to be a Warrior. That said, it's not a huge deal here.

Quote:
Illusory Dragon - It's okay I guess. It would be sweet if this creature had another ability, like Prowess (where the player's magic getting stronger makes the illusion stronger as well). Other than that, I don't really think the card would see play because it costs so much. I'm not that well versed in Commander though.
At this point, I should probably mention that I'm practically exclusively a limited player, so that's the lens that I look at all my cards through. Prowess does seem like a pretty cool idea on this guy though.
Quote:
Intimidating Roar - Flavor is new. Nonetheless, it's a :u: removal spell, that is very, very close to killing things. But :u: got this before.
Perhaps it would be better sticking it in the library a certain number of cards down, a la Commit?

Quote:
Raid the Hoard - I really hope that there's a Goblin Electromancer around here because a lot of these instants and sorceries are very, very expensive.
Limited archetypes pop up again here, this is something for the blue/green ramp deck to ramp into. I also wanted some more expensive cards in general for players to spend their Treasure on.

Quote:
Arix, have you heard about the legend of the dragon's gate? It should be familiar because of Magikarp.
I have a passing familiarity.


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: [DRD] Dragon's Dawn
PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 11:53 pm 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Jun 28, 2017
Posts: 146
UPDATE: First pass of the black commons.

Illusory Dragon gains prowess.

Intimidating Roar now sticks the creature in fourth from the top, rather than shuffling it in.


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2017 6:53 am 
Offline
Member
User avatar

Joined: Jun 28, 2017
Posts: 146
Aaand a big old update with the complete set!

A bunch of stuff has been changed and shifted around, and I like where the design has ended up, but development is still ongoing (and admittedly not a strong suit of mine).


Like this post
Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 15 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group